I think -slb -ntb -fow30 should be added to lm. (30 fog is exactly the time for race picking). This will help standardize what people play instead of having to type tons of mods every game.

what if you want perma -fow, or you want to nerf AOE damage by allowing 2 lanes? agree on -ntb

If you ask me it should also include -ban1, but dont ask me why. I just think it would be a good idea.

I also thought of -nt instead of -ht, because -ht supports killer specials (First time I agree with kiraice I think oO).

-slb shouldnt in -lm, but -fow30 is ok.

nt makes midgame go way faster leading to orc and naga to lose their early-mid advantage

i think combining any fog with both lanes open is a bad idea. other than that, i don't care about slb much, but it is kinda the standard.

nt is too much income and anyway ht does not help KILLER specials, it helps ALL specials, for ALL races, equally.

flor: if you want perma fog, or something weird, don't type lm. this is just about what should be standard for serious/competitive games. perma fog is no good for that, it adds so much luck/guessing.

the only luck I see in -fow is the first 120 seconds, other then that it is fun and gives world freezer and other specials a small advantage by having sight of the projectiles/victims

the luck is because you can't see what your opponents build, to try to counter it. fog takes away information and makes you guess instead.

so at the start, what does elf build? if you go archer, and they go defender, that's bad luck. if you go thirster, and they go assassin, that's bad luck. if you go melee, and they go air... if you go bottom lane, and they go mass siege on top lane...

and with fog, you can't tell when to turn your units on. you don't know what's coming. it screws up syncing and striking a lot. when you strike, you can't see how close reinforcements are, especially legs. it's important to scan the lane for incoming legs and include them in your strike, and fog messes that up.

Honestly, I agree with curi, but only because there's no better solution at the moment. Things like fow30 and slb are necessary right now because they solve some important problems that occur in default settings. However, while they do help, they are not the best solutions to these problems. When you have a wound the temporary solution is to put on a bandaid to stop the bleeding. But eventually you need your immune system to heal the wound. The same logic applies here in castle fight.

The fact that league players must play in a single lane and yet two lanes exist is a wound. It creates pathing issues because the lanes are too narrow, and It creates dumb top vs. bottom scenarios where it's a race to take down the castle. The bandaid here is -slx. It works; but to heal the wound we would really need to change the map layout. We either need to make one wider lane that goes down the middle and eliminate the other two as I've already suggested here in the poll thread that overwhelmingly approves of layout changes, or we need to create a real incentive to build in two lanes (-dom was an utter failure as an attempt at doing this). I recommend simply widening the lanes because not only is it easier to do but forcing the game into two lanes will set the project of balancing the gameplay in castle fight back about 10 months as it would unravel all of the work we've already done to improve the balance as of 1.11.

The fact that it is possible to wait to see which races your opponent has picked before picking yours is a wound. I've used this analogy before and I'll use it again: It's like playing rock paper scissors where one doesn't have to play their choice at the same time as their opponent. There are race counters in this game, which means we need to make it so that people cannot simply wait to counter. The bandaid here has been -fow, but the real solution lies in simply making it so the workers don't spawn until after 30 seconds or whatever the pick race time limit is. I think -d being added to -lm would also solve the problem, and while I know it is unpopular among my peers, I would not be opposed to this as a solution.

The fact that people are simply ignoring bonus gold and waiting to unit counter, often causing games where no one builds for a length into the early game, is a wound. The bandaid, a very terrible bandaid I might add, has been -fow. Sure a longer -fow will make unit countering less viable, but the best solution is to simply fix the bonus gold system so that it's equally strategically sound to rush and take the gold as it is to save and counter units. This is the running suggestion proposed by the authors of the comprehensive balance petition:
"- There should be a change to the building bonus gold system such that not the players who build first are rewarded but any player who builds their first building before three income lengths gets 30 bonus gold (that’s all units under 265g), and before six income lengths gets 20 bonus gold (units under 280g).

If we fixed these problems for real then -lm wouldn't need all these settings. slX would become obsolete and fow would no longer be necessary but a fun mode for people who choose to not have visibility of their opponent's base.

My stance on treasure boxes remains unsatisfied leaning apathetic. The arguments for changing it from a percentage increase to a static increase and moving it to the castle have so far sounded the most promising, but I'm not opposed to removing them entirely.

The debate still rages over taxes but I must say that the -ht change and its addition to -lm was one of my favorite changes in 1.13b. I love these taxes. The arguments I've heard against -ht are either weak and narrow-minded or simply downright fallacious.

I am in favor of adding -slb, -fow30, and -ntb to -lm as a temporary solution.

another problem with having 2 lanes is the weaker team can intentionally build all their leg units in the opposite lane as their opponents just to make the outcome more random, so they'll be losing one lane and winning the other a lot.

this could very well result in both sides having to make a bunch of towers in their weaker lane. then both sides getting siege. and yeah, a more random outcome than single lane games have.

Your wound bandaid thing isn't working.

The analogy? Seems to make sense to me.

yeah I think oms is right, some of the solutions dont really work that well either, for example in fow you can use maphack and -slb just makes the map look so.. ugly
still I dont think first building doesnt have advantages, if your starting units are balanced out, you have 20+15+10+5+extra money from income and, since their balanced out, its hard to really counter anyways

Curi, I'd prefer you couldn't sync so perfectly, etc. This game shouldn't be about micro (as kira has pointed out). I prefer permanent FOW.

syncing does not take micro, it takes counting seconds off at the right speed, knowing all unit prices, and knowing move speeds of units.

what you do is start your 400 gold unit (or most expensive), then every second you count down 380 360 340, etc. start the units of that price when you get to their number. and that's it plus adjusting for move speed. it's way more about counting down at the right speed than micro. and land units you can line up so they one in front blocks the others, so it's mostly just air units you have to adjust for.

While curi makes a good case above, I'd like to add that even when perma fog is on I still sync. It's trickier, but it's still doable. So if you're arguing for perma fog in order to prevent syncing you're wasting your energy.