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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 5:28 pm 
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screamingabdab wrote:
it took em a while to work the spell dmg thing, but now I know :)

however this

Quote:
Btw. phoenixes elemental damage is increased by damage oils/items


adds to the confusion for those who don't know, there's also the new Mud Golem tower, that deals Decay damage but that dmg benefits from +Spell Dmg.
Towers like this are going to confuse those who don't know. For me I think it'd be so much clearer is any damage that is written in a tooltip should be spell damage.


It's just a general rule with some exceptions. Mud Golem explicitly states that its damage is increased by spell damage so it's ok.
Besides there is a big difference between spell damage and non-spell damage so it's not right to just write spell damage in every tooltip.

As I said, the only exception, which doesn't state that it is one, is Phoenix.
And with damage oils/items I was not refering to spell damage oils/items.


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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 8:16 pm 
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der_kleine_Tomy wrote:
Towers either deal spell damage ("spell damage" or "damage" in the tooltip) or damage of a specific type (elemental/physical/decay... damage). If a tower deals damage of a specific type it is always considered physical (don't mix it up with the damage type "physical"), that means it is modified by armor type and armor value and can't hit Ethereal units. It works just like a regular attack but it is usually not modified by damage oils or damage increasing items unless it's explicitly stated.


So...

The base (physical) attack of all towers is modified by damage oils. This can be Physical, Decay, Energy, Elemental, Essence or Magic.
The triggered powers of many towers is modifed by spell damage oils. This is referred to in the tooltip as "spell damage" or "damage".
The other triggered powers are not modifiable by potions. These do Physical, Decay, Energy, Elemental or Essence.

Ok!

"Dude, I have a spell damage oil. I'm gonna put it on my Magic damage tower then, right?"
"No man, it should go on your Lightning Rod."
"But that does Energy..."
"Energy is just physical damage."
"Energy is physical? I thought my Broken Circle was Physical damage?"
"Yes it is. Physical means base damage of your tower, too."
"So Magic damage is physical?"
"Yep."
"But not Physical?"
"Yep!"
"So what's spell damage then?"
"That's what you get from the powers in the tooltip. Like in the Lightning Rod."
"Oh, ok, gotcha! Then I'm gonna put the spell damage oil on my Broken Circle -- it's higher level than my Buried Soul."
"Nope, don't do that, it won't have any effect."
"But you said..."
"Ok, sure, but the Lightning Rod does 'damage' so we know it's spell damage, see?"
"Errr... ok..."
"But the Broken Circle does physical damage, so the power in its tooltip isn't modified by spell damage."
"Oh. So, the Broken Circle does Physical damage for its physical damage; and it does Physical damage for its spell damage. And the one in the tooltip isn't modified by the oils?"
"That's right! Unless, sometimes it is. But then it will tell you in the tooltip."
"And the Timevault does Magic, but magic isn't spell damage, it's physical."
"Yes!"
"I'm gonna go play Call of Duty."

:lol:

The system works (I love this TD) but the naming conventions are a bit... wonky. :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 9:07 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 4:24 pm
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ahh dude you crack me up :D


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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 9:32 pm 
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If you see this map as a regular WC3 map the names are not confusing at all because the term "Magic" refers to an attack type of units (priests, sorceress, necromancer,...) and the term "Spell" refers to the damage type spell (obviously). The only confusing thing is that "physical" now refers to an attack type instead of the damage type "Physical". At least YouTD uses the word "physical" always to refer to the attack type although it's not that intuitive for most players because it's always seen as a generic term for all kind of attack types (Normal, Siege, Chaos, ...).
So I would change the attack type "Physical" instead of the attack type "Magic" if there is really a need to do so.


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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2011 1:28 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2011 4:25 am
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PowerMouse wrote:
"Dude, I have a spell damage oil. I'm gonna put it on my Magic damage tower then, right?"
"No man, it should go on your Lightning Rod."
"But that does Energy..."
"Energy is just physical damage."
"Energy is physical? I thought my Broken Circle was Physical damage?"
"Yes it is. Physical means base damage of your tower, too."
"So Magic damage is physical?"
"Yep."
"But not Physical?"
"Yep!"
"So what's spell damage then?"
"That's what you get from the powers in the tooltip. Like in the Lightning Rod."
"Oh, ok, gotcha! Then I'm gonna put the spell damage oil on my Broken Circle -- it's higher level than my Buried Soul."
"Nope, don't do that, it won't have any effect."
"But you said..."
"Ok, sure, but the Lightning Rod does 'damage' so we know it's spell damage, see?"
"Errr... ok..."
"But the Broken Circle does physical damage, so the power in its tooltip isn't modified by spell damage."
"Oh. So, the Broken Circle does Physical damage for its physical damage; and it does Physical damage for its spell damage. And the one in the tooltip isn't modified by the oils?"
"That's right! Unless, sometimes it is. But then it will tell you in the tooltip."
"And the Timevault does Magic, but magic isn't spell damage, it's physical."
"Yes!"
"I'm gonna go play Call of Duty."


Lol. Awesome read.

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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:42 am 
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Here is the archive of all the tower families in RC3.2. Details include element, rarity, goldcost, attacktype.
Attachment:
TwrExport YouTD RC3.2.zip [10.46 KiB]
Downloaded 315 times

Here is a simple script to read the file, feel free to play aroudn with it/export to excel.


Attachments:
towerInfoParse.gsl [2.28 KiB]
Downloaded 322 times

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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2012 1:55 pm 
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Here is the tower archive for YouTD_v1.00
Watch the homepage; map will be out this week.
Attachment:
TwrExport YouTD v1.00.tfa.zip [10.97 KiB]
Downloaded 301 times

(Use the gsl script i posted above [or make your own] to access the archive.)

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Goldcost to waveLevel & elementLevel relationship
Incremental Testmap Stub & Tower Creation Map


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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 6:28 am 
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Attachment:
TwrExport YouTD v1.01.tfa.zip [11.59 KiB]
Downloaded 238 times

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Goldcost to waveLevel & elementLevel relationship
Incremental Testmap Stub & Tower Creation Map


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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:16 pm 
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Would be great if it also contains information about trigger chance, trigger effect, ability, mana cost, base damage etc...

I really want to make a csv file with all the information of the towers.


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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 12:15 am 
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Meh, you can see all that on the website. Plus, now that mastercassim has added a tower/item changelog, there's no longer a need for this little archive.

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 Post subject: Re: Basic Tower Index
PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 9:21 am 
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Glowackos wrote:
Meh, you can see all that on the website. Plus, now that mastercassim has added a tower/item changelog, there's no longer a need for this little archive.

Being able to sort out the towers' stats makes finding combinations much easier :wink:


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